#SLOE: People's Basketball Sim League

TheSyndicate wrote:Yeah. For what it's worth, they've missed my DC once before a few seasons ago. I asked about it and it was owned and apologized for.

The above situations look like the inputters didn't MISS something but the game in fact was doing its thing.

Just my two cents. Also - I know many of these guys personally, and misleading a new GM is the last thing they'd want to do. We're all learning about the game together, and no one is more supportive of the new guys getting good than the folks that input the DC's.

I guarantee if you were in the playoffs against a more established team, the folks inputting would be rooting for you, but rooting or not, they'd do it accurately.

Again, this may explain my situation, and I just input my DC based on these recommendations, which is not the act of someone distrusting the people involved at least in terms of intentional actions. It does not explain ALL the info I provided or a lack of direct response to it . . . just, basically, calling me an asshole.

I know several of the guys, too. Likely, not as many as you, but some. I saw the Knicks thing a bit ago and chalked it up to error. Now, I see another instance . . . well, i need to say something. i get an answer, I take it at face value, respond in kind with a new DC showing exactly why I did what I did. If it works, great, maybe the instructions need to be clearer. If not, then we learned something.

Nevertheless, I am dead right to raise the issue and ask, and I'm bringing facts, not slander, to the table. We all want this process to be as clear as possible. When it's not . . . more questions arise.

Didn't this league move once as a result, at least in part, of certain questions?

TheSyndicate wrote:Yeah. For what it's worth, they've missed my DC once before a few seasons ago. I asked about it and it was owned and apologized for.

The above situations look like the inputters didn't MISS something but the game in fact was doing its thing.

Just my two cents. Also - I know many of these guys personally, and misleading a new GM is the last thing they'd want to do. We're all learning about the game together, and no one is more supportive of the new guys getting good than the folks that input the DC's.

I guarantee if you were in the playoffs against a more established team, the folks inputting would be rooting for you, but rooting or not, they'd do it accurately.

I have never claimed DC'S are always put in 100% correctly - I don't think any of the group that assists with inputting would. However, we do always try our best and are sensitive to making sure things are correct as much as possible.

In fact, when I make a mistake and someone asks me about it, I immediately admit it and apologize and fix it so it won't happen again (in fact, I put in the wrong Pace for the Mavericks on Friday, he asked about it via PM, I said "hey you are right, oops sorry" and we moved on). I think most of the team are the same way.

When you intimated there was a mistake made in the input, I took it seriously and checked immediately, ready to issue an apology if there was a mistake. When I found yours was put in as you requested, I posted it up to reassure you that no error was made on the part of the DC entry team. Had there been an error I would have acknowledged it and apologized.

The entire team takes the integrity of the league very seriously. I don't speak for them, just for me, but I have watched and I know they do. And I don't think this is aimed at me... I think this is frustration that the sim is not doing what you expect.

Frankly, I think you have probably hit on an edge case in the sim engine itself (so you are more or less breaking new ground). Having trid to program my own sim basketball game before, I would guess that what you arr seeing grows out of the "fill lineup" part of the substitution engine. Generally, you have logic that fills the positions in order, taking all eligible players, picking the one that should play, and then making him ineligible (so your algorithm doesn't take the guy you assigned to PG already and also assign him to SG). At a guess, FBB puts the five starters into an "eligible" pool to start the game, then fills from PG to C. So it looks at the best player (as it ranks them) to play PG from guys who are PG eligible and starters. It obviously puts AI first. You might expect to see something similar at another position (depending on how it prioritizes filling positions) with players eligible at multiple spots, but I haven't looked hard for it. That is just a guess, though... I don't know how it really works under the hood. None of us does, which is why we are all STILL learning (the developer has never said, for instance, what the various types of defense actually DO though I did some experiments and published my results a couple years ago as a guess... but I still am not rock solid sure).

Finally, Syndicate is right. I fully expect everyone not named Wig to be rooting for "whoever is playing the Hawks" come the playoffs.

WigNosy wrote:

TheSyndicate wrote:Yeah. For what it's worth, they've missed my DC once before a few seasons ago. I asked about it and it was owned and apologized for.

The above situations look like the inputters didn't MISS something but the game in fact was doing its thing.

Just my two cents. Also - I know many of these guys personally, and misleading a new GM is the last thing they'd want to do. We're all learning about the game together, and no one is more supportive of the new guys getting good than the folks that input the DC's.

I guarantee if you were in the playoffs against a more established team, the folks inputting would be rooting for you, but rooting or not, they'd do it accurately.

I have never claimed DC'S are always put in 100% correctly - I don't think any of the group that assists with inputting would. However, we do always try our best and are sensitive to making sure things are correct as much as possible.

In fact, when I make a mistake and someone asks me about it, I immediately admit it and apologize and fix it so it won't happen again (in fact, I put in the wrong Pace for the Mavericks on Friday, he asked about it via PM, I said "hey you are right, oops sorry" and we moved on). I think most of the team are the same way.

When you intimated there was a mistake made in the input, I took it seriously and checked immediately, ready to issue an apology if there was a mistake. When I found yours was put in as you requested, I posted it up to reassure you that no error was made on the part of the DC entry team. Had there been an error I would have acknowledged it and apologized.

The entire team takes the integrity of the league very seriously. I don't speak for them, just for me, but I have watched and I know they do. And I don't think this is aimed at me... I think this is frustration that the sim is not doing what you expect.

Frankly, I think you have probably hit on an edge case in the sim engine itself (so you are more or less breaking new ground). Having trid to program my own sim basketball game before, I would guess that what you arr seeing grows out of the "fill lineup" part of the substitution engine. Generally, you have logic that fills the positions in order, taking all eligible players, picking the one that should play, and then making him ineligible (so your algorithm doesn't take the guy you assigned to PG already and also assign him to SG). At a guess, FBB puts the five starters into an "eligible" pool to start the game, then fills from PG to C. So it looks at the best player (as it ranks them) to play PG from guys who are PG eligible and starters. It obviously puts AI first. You might expect to see something similar at another position (depending on how it prioritizes filling positions) with players eligible at multiple spots, but I haven't looked hard for it. That is just a guess, though... I don't know how it really works under the hood. None of us does, which is why we are all STILL learning (the developer has never said, for instance, what the various types of defense actually DO though I did some experiments and published my results a couple years ago as a guess... but I still am not rock solid sure).

Finally, Syndicate is right. I fully expect everyone not named Wig to be rooting for "whoever is playing the Hawks" come the playoffs.

I like Wig's logic here. I've had similar problems as those described by 42 and I've talked it through with Quailman and he gave me a similar answer. In fact, I had the exact same problem with Bobby Jackson and Gary Payton. The game has to have this sort of logic in place even for starters in the case of injury. It would be nice if it would just check to see if any of the players listed as starters are injured and then run through its own logic but I guess that must be hard to do (I doubt it) or some other reason.

All in all. I think there is just some silly logic here that we have to learn to navigate.

This seems to mostly happen with guards. Hell it happened to me in a playoff run with Bimbo Coles and Terry Porter or Tim Hardaway I Can't remember but I think it kept putting Bimbo in as SG when I had him as PG. I won a road game so I just let it roll.

I don't mind a batshit crazy computer. I mind instructions that say X and computer that does Y.

If it only affects me, the Frye me. I knew the Knicks case (still not addressed!), so I raised the issue THEN and only THEN.

I've input a clear DC. If the computer does it's own thing, then we need the instructions (or whatever the word is) updated. I plan on going 0-82 at some point. I don't give a Frye about losses. I care about dumping time and effort into something that I'm not actually learning.

Accidents, i can deal with. i said it before, I'll say it again.

I'm a great heel. This isn't about being a heel. This is about the Fryeing game.

Jesus christ, I go and get IRL married and all hell breaks loose. I'll look into the Knicks issue on Wednesday (when I'm back at work and not entertaining/enjoying company of in-laws and out of country friends i havent seen in 3 years).

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IamQuailman wrote:Jesus christ, I go and get IRL married and all hell breaks loose. I'll look into the Knicks issue on Wednesday (when I'm back at work and not entertaining/enjoying company of in-laws and out of country friends i havent seen in 3 years).

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Lol as opposed to what other kind of married?

<3

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NOLa. wrote:

IamQuailman wrote:Jesus christ, I go and get IRL married and all hell breaks loose. I'll look into the Knicks issue on Wednesday (when I'm back at work and not entertaining/enjoying company of in-laws and out of country friends i havent seen in 3 years).

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Lol as opposed to what other kind of married?

<3

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http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapcf/1 ... l.wedding/

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IamQuailman wrote:

NOLa. wrote:

IamQuailman wrote:Jesus christ, I go and get IRL married and all hell breaks loose. I'll look into the Knicks issue on Wednesday (when I'm back at work and not entertaining/enjoying company of in-laws and out of country friends i havent seen in 3 years).

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Lol as opposed to what other kind of married?

<3

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http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapcf/1 ... l.wedding/

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Disappointed you didn't use this.



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Why the F-U-C-K the Spurs are brought up in this Argument

Eazy P wrote:Why the F-U-C-K the Spurs are brought up in this Argument

I was accused of having something personal against WIG because the Hawks are successful. As a counter example, I pointed out that I refused a deal with you because you are successful, along with successful deals I have done with the Hawks. At no point was anything you did mentioned or discussed, just my response to a trade inquiry.

No offense meant, implied, or stated. It was an example to show that I do not restrict my economic warfare to WIG, but to all contenders. Short term assets only!

The Sprewell deal, I felt, weakened them though they were looking to do the deal, so I did that. Sprewell is better than Rider and Johnson.

42PhD wrote:

Eazy P wrote:Why the F-U-C-K the Spurs are brought up in this Argument

I was accused of having something personal against WIG because the Hawks are successful. As a counter example, I pointed out that I refused a deal with you because you are successful, along with successful deals I have done with the Hawks. At no point was anything you did mentioned or discussed, just my response to a trade inquiry.

No offense meant, implied, or stated. It was an example to show that I do not restrict my economic warfare to WIG, but to all contenders. Short term assets only!

The Sprewell deal, I felt, weakened them though they were looking to do the deal, so I did that. Sprewell is better than Rider and Johnson.

Eazy thinks the world is against him, pay him not mind and welcome to the club

42PhD wrote:

Eazy P wrote:Why the F-U-C-K the Spurs are brought up in this Argument

I was accused of having something personal against WIG because the Hawks are successful. As a counter example, I pointed out that I refused a deal with you because you are successful, along with successful deals I have done with the Hawks. At no point was anything you did mentioned or discussed, just my response to a trade inquiry.

No offense meant, implied, or stated. It was an example to show that I do not restrict my economic warfare to WIG, but to all contenders. Short term assets only!

The Sprewell deal, I felt, weakened them though they were looking to do the deal, so I did that. Sprewell is better than Rider and Johnson.

Oh ok. I was like WTF I did now.

RPF wrote:

42PhD wrote:

Eazy P wrote:Why the F-U-C-K the Spurs are brought up in this Argument

I was accused of having something personal against WIG because the Hawks are successful. As a counter example, I pointed out that I refused a deal with you because you are successful, along with successful deals I have done with the Hawks. At no point was anything you did mentioned or discussed, just my response to a trade inquiry.

No offense meant, implied, or stated. It was an example to show that I do not restrict my economic warfare to WIG, but to all contenders. Short term assets only!

The Sprewell deal, I felt, weakened them though they were looking to do the deal, so I did that. Sprewell is better than Rider and Johnson.

Eazy thinks the world is against him, pay him not mind and welcome to the club

Shut up RPF. Slob on a Fatty

Eazy P wrote:

42PhD wrote:

Eazy P wrote:Why the F-U-C-K the Spurs are brought up in this Argument

I was accused of having something personal against WIG because the Hawks are successful. As a counter example, I pointed out that I refused a deal with you because you are successful, along with successful deals I have done with the Hawks. At no point was anything you did mentioned or discussed, just my response to a trade inquiry.

No offense meant, implied, or stated. It was an example to show that I do not restrict my economic warfare to WIG, but to all contenders. Short term assets only!

The Sprewell deal, I felt, weakened them though they were looking to do the deal, so I did that. Sprewell is better than Rider and Johnson.

Oh ok. I was like WTF I did now.

Nope, nothing I caught you on. Got my eye you, though.

Sorry about that.

Eazy P wrote:

RPF wrote:

42PhD wrote: I was accused of having something personal against WIG because the Hawks are successful. As a counter example, I pointed out that I refused a deal with you because you are successful, along with successful deals I have done with the Hawks. At no point was anything you did mentioned or discussed, just my response to a trade inquiry.

No offense meant, implied, or stated. It was an example to show that I do not restrict my economic warfare to WIG, but to all contenders. Short term assets only!

The Sprewell deal, I felt, weakened them though they were looking to do the deal, so I did that. Sprewell is better than Rider and Johnson.

Eazy thinks the world is against him, pay him not mind and welcome to the club

Shut up RPF. Slob on a Fatty

Why can't you two just attack me like decent fellas?

Nah can't do that. Me and RPF rivalry has been since the origin. Well at least since he has became a GM.

Eazy P wrote:Nah can't do that. Me and RPF rivalry has been since the origin. Well at least since he has became a GM.

Who's winning?

I am talking bout A rivalry on the forums. It died down a bit tho. Insults, Meme and Gif wars. Me and RPF went at it and even had our own Sticky thread.

Yea it was neat, but then they got soft as vaginal lips and its never flickered back since

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Easy pickings here. I don't see why my open and hot warfare against the dynasties viewed as anything but a positive. For those not in a dynasty, have someone fight some of the fight. For those in a dynasty, if you defeat greater challenges, you are a greater champion.

42PhD wrote:Easy pickings here. I don't see why my open and hot warfare against the dynasties viewed as anything but a positive. For those not in a dynasty, have someone fight some of the fight. For those in a dynasty, if you defeat greater challenges, you are a greater champion.

Tbf we've grown more sensitive over the months. That's probably all it is.

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NOLa. wrote:

42PhD wrote:Easy pickings here. I don't see why my open and hot warfare against the dynasties viewed as anything but a positive. For those not in a dynasty, have someone fight some of the fight. For those in a dynasty, if you defeat greater challenges, you are a greater champion.

Tbf we've grown more sensitive over the months. That's probably all it is.

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Tickle tickle, <expletive deleted>

AI sucks

PaulyP wrote:AI sucks

His PER agrees. It's only 20 with significant minutes on a losing team. I expect no bids on him in UFA as a result.